Bendy, I see what you are trying to get at but I am not sure the audience will understand or even pay attention to what you add about white space unless you are adding a specific rule for each document. For example "Each document must have a 3 inch left margin."

Does that make sense?

Yes, I was wondering about specifying healthy margins too. I've just seen too many documents with tiny crunched up text with no gutters, margins or breathing space and with pictures so small you need a magnifying glass. Thanks, good to think all around this before writing.

Oh, and welcome to Typophile! :)

Ben, you might refer to Gerrit Noordzij's Letterletter page 126.

Noordzij presents a list representing the hierarchy of white space in typography:
1. the white shapes in words
2. the shapes between words
3. the space between lines
4. the space between columns
5. the background of text
He says it's order is a condition of legibility.

I might add that in the macrotypography domain effective use of white space is a condition of robust navigability, and distinctive use of what space a condition of brand specificity and cohesion.

Well for one, cramming tons of imagery/text/whatever into every conceivable space will reduce the amount of information that people are actually able to /absorb/. Leaving white space makes it easier for users to focus on whats important.

Much of the discipline of graphic design (and art, architecture, photography, typography, etc.) is concerned with the use of white space: scale, proportion, rhythm, contrast ...

To condense all this into a simple instruction for everyone to follow seems a bit ambitious to me. Perhaps the generous margins are the thing to go after all. They'll still manage to produce atrocious layouts with them, I assure you. I know I can, even after all these years :o)

White space is a waste of paper, except in the margins where readers need to place their thumbs when holding the document. To keep things separate, use rules.

Goodonya, Nick!

Nick, don't you find that newspaper layout really offputting? In terms of readability it may be ok but it doesn't work for me from a designer's point of view. I'm thinking navigability (not knowing where to start reading) and the amount of information are difficult.

I found this on Wikipedia 'Judicious use of white space can give a page a classic, elegant, or rich appearance. For example, upscale brands often use ad layouts with little text and a lot of white space. Inexpert use of white space can make a page appear incomplete.'

And this from another website 'white space is used for purely semiotic values; for values of presentation which transcend economic values by insisting that the image of what you present is more important than the paper you could be saving.'

So the 'luxury' aspect is more suitable for selling expensive products than it would be for setting a purely informational newspaper, perhaps.

However, I'm suddenly worried about the last sentence of the Wikipedia piece, so perhaps it is better after all to specify margins than expect non-designers to use white space cleverly.

White space is a waste of paper, except in the margins where readers need to place their thumbs when holding the document. To keep things separate, use rules.

Well, it depends. You don't really need margins, let the silly buggers move their thumbs.

Keeping the number of pages down can be evaluated. The cost of paper, the cost of makeready (if printed), and in human costs, especially the ergs expended in turning pages.

This can present a real challenge with, say, a title page. Their just isn't enough copy to fill the page. Perhaps write a little more? Or maybe add some ornaments, the print equivalent of tarting up with earrings, rouge, etc.

* * *

If you are preparing a print piece, you can a least illustrate the point on white space by including a sample of asymmetric typography contrasted to centered typography.

The use of white space is a comfort matter, just like every other element of typography. Seeing and appreciating it is a matter of learning; once learned, it becomes part of an audience's expectations & reactions.

bendy said:
> Nick, don’t you find that newspaper layout really offputting?

um...

> I found this on Wikipedia

ok, now look up "sarcasm" on wikipedia... :+)

***

charles said:
> You don’t really need margins,
> let the silly buggers move their thumbs.

charles, you can skip wikipedia... ;+)

-bowerbird

You could quote from Dan Friedman’s piece about the semiotic value of whitespace as a signifier of wealth and class. IIRC it’s in Looking Closer volume one.

I hope you post your guidelines when you finish, Bendy.

Sharon

Bendy, A List Apart has an article on white space (or whitespace, as it is called therein) here. While it is not an exhaustive article, it might give you some ideas for the text you want to write.

I also recommend Alex White's The Elements of Graphic Design: Space, Unity, Page Architecture, and Type. Great book on white space.

Great book on white space.

Well, given Alex's name...

Whitespace is typically greatly overplayed by graphic designers. It's certainly not useless, but too often it's made to overpower the text as a design element! So much so that I once contemplated publishing a clip art CD of whitespace shapes... :-)

hhp

>ok, now look up “sarcasm” on wikipedia... :+)

Uh. Yup, I did wonder about that :P

>I hope you post your guidelines when you finish, Bendy.

Hm. I'll think about that...I'm not sure they'll stand up to the rigorous professionalism of this forum!

I've been looking at WaterAid's Corporate Identity Guidelines which cover a lot of the kinds of things I'd like to include. (I picked an INGO since we work a lot with them and our comms can tend to be similar.)

Hrant, a whitespace clipart CD would be amazing!

Anyway, thanks for all the links and ideas here. Good good stuff. :)

bendy said:
> Uh. Yup, I did wonder about that :P

truth be told, i thought your response might have been ironic as well.

and when people can't tell if it's irony or not, that's the _best_ irony!

it's all in fun. feel free to dish it back to me any time you like. :+)

-bowerbird

I don't think sarcasm translates very well on the web ;)

"Include some space to let the text breathe" is a useful tip.
It can be as simple as just making sure that headlines aren't sized up to fill the available space.

But "White Space", as an element of asymmetric modernist page layouts is problematic.
I don't think it's something that most people can do without a fair amount of study and practice, developing an understanding and eye for it.

Consider modernist architecture. A large office block by Mies, with its expanses of plain and pure form, expensive materials, discrete detailing and subtle proportions, is beautiful. But in lesser hands with less budget, modernism became a crude and brutal exercise of corporate/government power.

White Space is ideologically fraught.
Its origins, connected to the clean and healthy aspirations of modernist design with social purpose.
And now the environmental issue.

Ignoring screen display, consider that White Space is an inherent waste of resources.
In corporate or institutional publications, designers are taught to waste paper to create the "minimalist" aesthetic. A large part of the effect relies on identifying the awe of big size with the power of the publisher/advertiser who can afford to waste paper--that is the aesthetic. We have established a norm where small publications and advertisements just don't look right for large organizations. So big corporations and government are inherently wasteful.

Where does the creative industry get off, with its conscience intact, talking about being green, when the creative that it honors most is the work which wastes most paper with big pictures and lots of white space? If you're so creative, get the message across efficiently, sell the product with a smaller ad.

And if small is beautiful, then perhaps spend longer conceptualizing and writing to shrink and concentrate the message, because labor is ultimately greener than materials, minimize the physical footprint, and use rules and borders to separate matter, because that takes up less real estate than White Space.

Yes, I was a bit concerned with the environmental effect of using lots of white space. Luckily most of our documents are viewed electronically but are still sometimes printed, so that's not so great if there's a lot of unproductive space.

I guess I'm partly annoyed to see my nice layouts meddled with, so we end up with a welcome note squashed on the bottom of the contents page. Maybe I should just accept that I'm going to have to copy edit and layout everything important that goes out. Hopefully a few simple guidelines can make that job less time consuming.

Setting up a word template with custom margins and styles might be helpful for letters and internal documents. You need to play around with some different image files to get the logo printing right, cause Microsoft don't really like those vectors.

White Space is ideologically fraught. So true Nick. One reality from personal experience is that most corporations are more concerned with cost effective design than minimizing their physical footprint. It's a good thing the two typically go hand in hand.

What is the ROI on white space?

There is one, but that's how the powers that be are going to frame it when you are asked to justify it.

It's probably better to use words to argue for it without calling it that. Instead of saying 'use white space' say 'don't overly crowd things'. 'White Space' is seen as 'wasted space' in the world of business and what's the point of that? ;o)

"You could quote from Dan Friedman’s piece about the semiotic value of whitespace as a signifier of wealth and class. IIRC it’s in Looking Closer volume one." [James Puckett]

James, don't you mean Keith Robertson's "On white space / when less is more"?

>say ’don’t overly crowd things’.

You know, that makes a lot of sense. I think the ROI is that the people reading the documents with whitespace feel like they're more special, since time has been spent to consider the reading experience and the professional appearance. Nobody wants to approach a document that doesn't look neat. (Sorry, I have to work with a lot of very horrible looking documents: red capitals with 'marching ants', unaligned tabs, broken tables, pictures the size of postage stamps and needless font/paragraph/design inconsistencies).

In case anybody is interested, I found an excellent thesis online about the use of white space in graphic design. Thank you, Dong Hyun Lee :)

I don't see the virtue of emptiness on it's own merit, unless it is well justified by a solid concept, and is well balanced. To me, the phrases " I like that you are using white space" and "I like that you are utilizing all of the available space" are equally valid.

This artwork would not benefit from the addition of white space:

Yet This one wouldn't work without it:

Back in school, I always got annoyed on critiques when works were praised for the amount of negative space as if though it were an achievement in an of itself.
_____________________________________________
Personal Art and Design Portal of Ivan Gulkov
www.ivangdesign.com

Outside of, in and around the type, there's white space at,

Nick>... the margins where readers need to place their thumbs when holding the document.

...or write notes, or I guess write notes on their thumbs.

and Vertically, white space is a tool to assist in the organization of the document for better navigation.

>This artwork would not benefit from the addition of white space:...
Nice.
And true, (though I doubt it was considered artwork by its makers).
But then it needed (and presumably had), a lot of 'clear' space around it when it was used.
I can barely read it with the frame round it.

>Yet This one wouldn’t work without it:
Nice.
...but it doesn't work, I think, out of context in a sea of white, compared say, to when it's before your very eyes and distinct from everything else, as it was meant.

Cheers!