first post, still gettin the hang of this.

The double R is not working like this, I read it RRhoads and the red R is kicking "Design & Construction". You also have RH and AD letters stick to each other.

Maybe placing the R within an element?

Ah! you could have some fun with beams and braces to support your R.

The fact being that your unfinished R is a work in progress, and under construction. And if gravity were involved, it would fall on its butt.

In short, do what doozers do.

Crossing serifs are always a big no-no? I generally not a big serif fan.

The kick was my struggle to do something w/ nothing. I tried talking to him about naming his company w/ imagery that may make it memorable, but he really likes his name. It currently feels static, old and boring.

He likes the fonts, but to me it looks like I could have designed this thing in Word.

I have tried a few shapes to integrate w/ the R and have come up short.

I'm going to try to do what he dooz. This needs a little life kicked in it.

The R seems too heavy, in particular, the leg of the R.

A possibility would be a superscripted H and the leg of the R could cradle it? Just random thought.

i like the top one but whit out secont R just start reading it whit Simbol of "R" and ceap it to whit becround but play whit Desagn & Construction too thight

(wrong image)

listening to the fraggle wisdom, I came with these. I havent thinned up the "R" yet (when its separate it really shows). I agree w/ Tiffany about the thickness of Design & Construction, but I've been over-ruled by the client on multiple occasions. I'll probably try sneaking in a medium version. I mainly like the top one, but I included a few along the way.

It's feeling healthier now, not so detached. I really appreciate the ideas.

I like the ornamentation of the number 2 H. Classical. I dont like the red roof though.

What's an all white mark look like?

Kill 5 and 6. too busy.

Good Work.

Andrew

yeah, 4,5,6 are dead. Today I'll put up a couple new adjustments. White looked ok, but I liked the red better, althought same color does look pretty good in a low contrast situation. (I'll put that up too.) Currently I am leaning slightly to red roof (less vs overt), but im going to simplify the ornementation on #2 to see if that changes my mind.

Any kerners out there have an opinion on the HO? It seems to want to breathe, but any more space and the roofline doesnt drop into the O as smoothly

Maybe have all the letters in 'rhoads' the same size in 1 and 2 - that way the roof might feel less out of place.

Also I prefer & to +..
+ seems too modern for the classical style you're using.. Hmm.. The plus in 2 is nice though. : )

I'll try to put one of those up as well Jonathan, but I think the Larger "R" catches the roof nicely, and sets up the left triangle line off the top of the "R".

The red roof is just not integrated yet. Its more of a hat for the H, weighing it down. And the spacing between roof and H is bothersome, especially on white.

here's the latest:

Ampersand, no plus.

You really like to use red, huh?

RHOADS in red? Design & Construction in black?
The logo reads to me as ROADS with a gate in between.

I like the gate in bottom left best. Top right too much detail.

Work on the RHO spacing. OA.

I like the progress.

Andrew

Plain text and ampersand ended up as the final. No roof, no hat, no gate. Thanks for all the help and ideas. Sometimes designs are just plain stubborn and never quite make it, but you guys helped me make the most of what I had.

Bottom right is the best so far but why do you need the double red & and symbol of H. I personally feel like the logos are caught between being elegant and communicative. It's not there though, the best one though I think is the third one up on the right it's a little overdone but the hierarchy is better than the others. Gluck.

I agree that the R needs to be anchored, somehow, visually. The weight of "Design & Construction" seems heavy. Call me boring, but I often consider the thinnest and thickest portions to find a middle ground. I wonder if that line should match the thinnest (or close to) part of the serif face?

Does the H need to be red in order to be read?