A lot of those things are addressed in the fantastic, and free, Font Explorer from Linotype.

And they're working on the Windows version...
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They've been working on that for awhile now. Still that's not the point of the topic. What kind of features are missing from the current crop of font management tools that the elite font users would like to see included.

If you had the money/power/programming skills what would you include?

I really have no complaints about Font Explorer. It's attractive (much more so than Fontbook) and seems to have all the features I require. I guess it's not always easy to track down foundry detail - which was a nice feature of Font Reserve - but that isn't that important to me.

It would be nice to be able to sort by style without having to create sets like I do, but that would probably require the foundries to tag their fonts.

When I installed Font Explorer I basically devoted most of a day to creating sets that were useful to me. Every now and then I decide to add a new set and have to page through thousands of fonts to find ones that fit the categories. But basically, as in iTunes, once you set it up then as you add new fonts it's pretty easy to maintain.

And, as mentioned above, it's free! Plus unlike iTunes it doesn't direct you to a store every chance it gets.

It would be nice to be able to sort by style without having to create sets like I do, but that would probably require the foundries to tag their fonts.

I'm in a windows environment, so I don't have access to Font Explorer, which sounds like a much better application than Suitcase. Regardless, I think a lot of the "font management" apps out there don't actually give much help in the way of managing one's fonts.

Example: I collect fonts piecemeal. I try to organize them into folders on my hard drive based on Foundry, and then add them to Suitcase creating Sets based on that font;s Style. It's a laborious process that If I would accidentally delete a set, I'm pretty much screwed till I find the time to "re-manage" my font collection.

If the actual software keep track of my fonts for me, this wouldn't be much of an issue, and then if I could set-up a keywords/tags for specific fonts to help me find them faster, that would be another piece in the management issue I have with Suitcase.

In essence, Suitcase isn't a font management application, it's a font activation tool and that's about it's limits.

Many font management tools are restricted by the hooks and services the OS's provide so, please don't limit suggestions to what's techncially possible at the application layer. Ideas around OS-level hooks and services would be helpful too.

An example. Sophisticated font version control - Session based activation of specific font versions on a per application or even per document basis - for when you absolutely need Comic Sans MS version 2.01 and not 2.03.

Cheers, Si

When I began, I was whit ATM and I liked it, after whit the OS X we cant use ATM and I change for suitcase, I had hated this software !!!! Now two weeks ago I changed for fontexplorer, right now I cant said I loved it but its better than suitcase.

Just my opinion

Sii, that's a great idea. Especially if it could maintain multiple versions across multiple foundries. Is that a Monotype version or a Linotype version?

I was looking forward to download the new version of Suitcase for Windows but I am little bit disappointed now. The application is now really fast, there is an InDesign auto activation plugin, but I still miss many features:

- font searching
- subfolders inside folders allowing more detailed grouping of fonts
- custom labels and rating of fonts
- font family grouping
- sophisticated preview of glyphs (based on encodings, unicode sets etc.)
- intelligent management of duplicate fonts and their versions
- possibility to print many different specimens

In the future I would like to have the possibility to find the appropriate fonts according font style, year of creation, author, language covered in glyph set, OT features, similarity etc.

And, as mentioned above, it’s free! Plus unlike iTunes it doesn’t direct you to a store every chance it gets.

I don't mean to hijack this thread, but this hint explains a way to convert all of those iTunes arrow links so that they lead not to the store, but to very useful views of your own music library. Once you've done that, iTunes doesn't put any more commercial pressure on you than Font Explorer.

I like the ability to type in sample text and *quickly* cycle through the different typefaces, either with the scroll wheel or arrow keys. So I'm very happy with FontExplorer X on the Macs I have, and Font Reserve for the PC.

FR for the PC hasn't been updated for ages and isn't very pretty, but it does exactly what I want it to do: quickly enter text samples and scroll through the fonts I have with lightning-like speed. It's very different from the last Mac version of FR I used where I had to click on each font to preview the sample (to hell with that).

I also like in Font Explorer that you can start to type in the font name and it leaps to the font. Font Reserve didn't have that feature.

I also realized that Font Explorer DOES have the detailed foundry info I thought it didn't. I just learned, for example, that Asswipe is pronounced "Ah-swee-pay". Ya gotta love a font management software that gives you that kind of info!

My perfect app would be Font Explorer with better capabilities for identifying and fixing corrupt fonts, and the ability to block all system fonts from appearing in Application font menu. Like Andrew, I don't even bother managing fonts; with spotlight there's no need worry about that anymore, so what I really need is software that addresses:

- Apple including a bunch of non-English fonts with the English OS X install and Adobe's apps refusing to run without them.
- Apple sticking duplicates of system fonts into my home directory.
- Poorly designed software that just dumps fonts into the system fonts directory so that I have to deal with them in every program I have.

Like Andrew, I don’t even bother managing fonts; with spotlight there’s no need worry about that anymore

Really? How does spotlight help you manage fonts? Can it automatically activate fonts when you open an application - and deactivate them when you close it? Sort your fonts by style? Create a set that shows you to view all your sans serifs at once? Allow you to type in text for a preview? Give you a character map? I'm baffled.

Really? How does spotlight help you manage fonts?

I was referring to Andrew's comment:

In essence, Suitcase isn’t a font management application, it’s a font activation tool and that’s about it’s limits.

I use FontExplorer similarly. The software is just there for activating fonts, but when it comes to actually managing the fonts I usually just use spotlight to grab a file by name and fire it up, as opposed to the old method of just dumping every single font into a management app and dealing with them all that way. I don't really do much with sets; most of the sets I've set up only became sets because FontExplorer does it automatically when I add families, it isn't something I need to do on my own. As for type previews, I don't find myself using that feature very often because just seeing the words set in FontExplorer is usually too detached from context to be especially helpful.

I would like the speed of Suitcase, which I find to be fantastic!, with the previews of Font Expert, with the way Font Agent Pro for Windows handles the proper sorting of fonts, handling duplicates, etc. Please pardon my punctuation.

Sharon

I'm really suprised that no one else wants control of OpenType layout. I would like to be able to control which OTF features where being used when viewing a specimen.

Sophisticated font version control - Session based activation of specific font versions on a per application or even per document basis - for when you absolutely need Comic Sans MS version 2.01 and not 2.03.

sii, as far as I know Suitcase is the only font manager that really addresses this issue. The new Suitcase for Windows implements the same Font Sense technology from Suitcase Fusion. When a font is added to the database, a unique identifier is created based on several values within the font. It's similar to a checksum. During auto-activation, this can be used to distinguish between different fonts of the same name.

The other advantage of Font Sense is that it could be used to match up metadata. I wish Suitcase had a good way to import/export metadata. I think I want everything filip blazek lists. Lots of metadata-- the ability to sort and group by metadata--and the ability to share it.

A related feature that I consider critical is the ability to back up data. There's no point creating a bunch of sets and adding metadata if I don't have the ability to back up this effort or migrate it to a new system. I probably replace my laptop every 18 months. I back it up once a month. If my current hd dies, I know that I can restore my setup. On Suitcase for Windows, this can now be accomplished by restoring the Vault to the same relative location. However, I consider it a necessary feature for any font manager.

In the professional publishing world, some of these features are accomodated by client/server font management solutions like Font Reserve Server.

A related feature that I consider critical is the ability to back up data. There’s no point creating a bunch of sets and adding metadata if I don’t have the ability to back up this effort or migrate it to a new system.

I agree, this is a major key point in font management, what's the point of putting all the effort and time into managing your fonts if in a short period of time you'll have to do it again to another computer. This would be especially helpful in terms of migrating data across multiple computer if you don't have a server system. Like in a school computer lab, everyone uses the same fonts, why can't they create a "default" group of sets and port them to all the computers that might not be setup on a server.

In the professional publishing world, some of these features are accommodated by client/server font management solutions like Font Reserve Server.

Idealistic, but not practical for the single user.

For Font Explorer I would assume (but have not tried) that if you bring all the application support - preferences, cache, etc that your sets would be preserved. I've certainly done that with other apps.

It's interesting the different things people look for in a font management tool. I honestly don't understand anyone who sees Font Explorer or Suitcase as just an activation tool, that is a limited use of a sophisticated application (altho I will point out that Andrew is using windows). As a designer I really rely on the sets I've set up as a starting point. I want to use a sans but am tired of falling back on TheSans or Scala so I browse thru my sans et voila, Abadi. Haven't used that in years.

But it just points up the different ways designers work I guess.

I think that if you absolutely need Comic Sans - any version - you should consider switching careers.

I'm on windows, Patty, but I agree with needing sets. I have sets for styles, foundries and for each project. It was worth the time I spent setting them up.

Sharon

I’m on windows, Patty, but I agree with needing sets. I have sets for styles, foundries and for each project. It was worth the time I spent setting them up.

I might not have said it, but I use sets too. I have them currently for styles only: Sans, Serif, Rounded, Script and so on. My complaint isn't the ability to set these up, but that "I" have to set them up and maintain them, and if for some reason I delete said sets, I don't have them backed up anywhere and would essentially have to recommit the time and effort that I already committed to setting up new sets. In my eyes, that's not font management. It's a lot of work for a small part of the design process (no offense to the part fonts play in design, just the tool to get the fonts into the process.)

And I am on a Windows system, which I've noted before has been shunned against by Extensis. I'm no dummy I can see all the great features available in Suitcase Fusion for Mac. Why can't I have those same features in my Windows version?

Well said, Andrew.

How does Typograf font manager stack up against all these programs? I was looking on Linotype's site, and they have this too, although it's not free, but it sounds like it has a lot of the features people want. Does anyone have it, or have used it?

My advice to you Andrew is DON'T DELETE THE SETS.

Just kidding. As I said above, tho, more sophisticated tagging - i.e. that didn't require manual maintenance from the user - would require the foundries themselves to tag the fonts and it probably wouldn't be retroactive anyway to the fonts you already own. I don't see how you can expect a font management tool to instinctively "know" how to organize your fonts. I think categorizing your fonts is NOT a small part of the design process. It's a time commitment up front, when you first load the fonts in, but not a lot of work to maintain and update as you add new fonts. And if you don't delete them, there's no problem.

Yes it's nice that in iTunes a lot of the songs come already tagged by genre but personally I end up labeling them quite often myself.

Personally I prefer the option of making my own categories anyway.

"A lot of those things are addressed in the fantastic, and free, Font Explorer from Linotype.

And they’re working on the Windows version…"

That's hilarious, "they're working on the Windows version..." Priceless. What, 2 years now and they're still working on it? Man, that's serious commitment to Windows users!

What really pisses me off about this is that when (if) the Windows version comes out, I can never, ever use it out of stupid petty spite at how long the taunt of a Windows version has been just off in the distance.

Blech, yeesh, I mean, come on...

Well I think they still don't make Autocad for the Mac.

So all these poor architects are stuck using PCs for all these years.

It works both ways.

Touché Patty, good point. (Although of course those "poor" and "stuck" jabs get me rankled.)

ps. Whoa, I just noticed on the main page preview (background text) that the "é" in the line above got dropped, so the preview read:

Jason: Touch Patty, good point...

Hey Mr. Topic Hi-Jacker... Nobody cares if Flash can't handle accents. Sorry, I'm trying to prevent the Resume-DPI scandle from happening again...

hey nobody knows about typograf, the other program on linotype.com? Any users of that?

I wasn't aware of it, till you brought it up, but from the description, it looks like you need to know German to use it (or at least understand how to use it.)

It might be worth starting a secondary topic asking the community what their thoughts are on Typograf. You'd probably have better luck getting more replies from our German members, than in this topic.

EDIT: I clicked the link to download, and turns out I was wrong about needing to understand German. It's in English. Here's a better view of the program: Typograf Font Program

It looks like it has a good bit of features, including Character Maps.

Nice jab Andrew, I'll do my best to stay on point here (not sure why I'm so prone to splitting threads off in various directions...).

I would like user-based id3 style tagging in my font management tool so I can make custom groups/lists based on more disparate contextual or organic information. ie Cooper Black might include: Warm, EasyJet, Mit DR, Poster, rounded, Display, serif, Pet Sounds.

I wrote a blog post about it a while ago actually;

PS - I can't add my blog/site/podcast url to my profile on here 'cos this site thinks my '.info' domain is invalid. It clearly isn't!; Anyone got a clue how to get around that?

Well, I've played around with Typograf, and I can honestly say, it's a confusing mess that would require more involvement from my end than I'm currently interesting to invest. I will admit, it's feature laden.

From the initial start up, I wasn't impressed with how the fonts were listed and viewed, I would have preferred a grouped listing that I could then "expand". One feature that caught my eye was the "Typography" link. Chocked full of information about such things as the History of Typeface, Type Classifications, Links to fonts on the web, descriptions of font technology and so on... If there's any reason to use this program it's for the help topics and information listed there.

I stole this from Mr Miller's Post on this the Vista Topic Node 31902

Now this is really off topic, but since you question my software knowledge, I must clarify.
The above image is currently what Photoshop CS 2 spits out on my PC. It looks similar for Microsoft products. Here’s the challenge / question: Why can’t this list, within any program using common user-interface elements, have an organizable folder-font list?
Back on subject, it seems Vista also spits out a linear list of fonts.

That would be a great feature for font management software, control all contextual font menus and set up non-linear organization in those menus. Especially in regards to font naming and family grouping.

I tried Typograf also and initially I had the same reaction. It seemed confusing. However, after exploring it a little more, I fell in love with it. There is an expanded Font Management area which allows the grouped listings you can expand. And the preview windows are amazing. You have so many ways to view your fonts. It's very fast and it loads an icon with access to your font groups in windows startup. Just click the icon and check which of your folders you want to install/uninstall.

A couple of things I haven't figured out yet but I think I'll like it.
Lots of features for only $35.

Sharon

Edit: Typograf also allows adding keywords to enhance searching although I haven't tried this yet.